Denial WIKI change / addition announcement thread.

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ral-clan
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Postby ral-clan » Thu Jan 15, 2009 6:42 am

Well, Commodore Basic v2 is MicroSoft BASIC....or at least it is a MicroSoft product. We know that because there's Easter Egg, isn't there, in most Commodore Basic v2 8-bits so that when you type

WAIT 6502, 1

it supposedly prints "MICROSOFT!" on the screen. Does anyone know how to call up the Easter Egg?

There is a much longer description of the Commodore purchase of MicroSoft BASIC as an unlimited liscence (for 8-bits) in the book "On the Edge: The Spectacular Rise and Fall of Commodore" - I think even Bill Gates is quoted on the subject. I'm not sure if you'd consider that an "academic source" though.

http://www.amazon.com/Edge-Spectacular-Rise-Fall-Commodore/dp/0973864907

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Postby carlsson » Thu Jan 15, 2009 7:31 am

The Easter Egg only appears in PETs with BASIC V2. On the VIC-20 and C64 it no longer exists as far as I know.
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Postby Richard James » Thu Jan 15, 2009 6:38 pm

Yes it is Micro-Soft BASIC relabeled as CBM BASIC. I don't know about the book reference, even though it is a better source academically, I don't have a copy to check against. If someone does have a copy they could make a reference similar to a Wikipedia one. References should go to the bottom of the page. If you have a reference you can even quote a paragraph.
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Postby PaulQ » Thu Jan 15, 2009 6:45 pm

Ah, when Commodore was the big, greedy corporation calling all the shots, and Microsoft was the little upstart doing whatever they could to appease the corporate giants and survive...those were the golden days of computers.

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Postby bokvamme » Fri Jan 16, 2009 2:11 pm

There is a youtube video about Commodore with Jack Tramiel talking about the deal Commodore did with Microsoft (Commdore 64 - 25th Anniversary Celebration). They paid a fixed sum for the right to use the basic, not 2-3 dollars for each computer as I think Microsoft wanted.
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Postby Pedro Lambrini » Fri Jan 16, 2009 2:47 pm

In the book 'On The Edge' Chuck Peddle doesn't explicitly say but alludes to the figure of a $10,000 lump sum. Later in the book it's mentioned that Apple paid twice as much and the author (Brian Bagnall) puts the sum of $20,000 in parenthises. :)

I'll have a look around for the section telling of the Commodore deal in the book this evening.

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Postby Richard James » Sat Jan 17, 2009 2:05 am

I just tried to write a program using the Memory Map in the Wiki. It says that colour memory begins at $9400 which is the entire colour RAM. It needs to be broken up somehow so that people don't get confused about where colour RAM is mapped. The confusion lies in the fact that there is 1K RAM in nibbles at $9400 but when the VIC20 is not RAM expanded the colour codes are mapped to $9600 and when it is expanded the colour codes are mapped to $9400, also by changing a register in the VIC chip you can change this. Not quite sure how to word this. I have changed the Wiki to read like this.

- $9400-$97FF: Color RAM (1K of 4 bit nibbles) Note Color is mapped to $9600-$97FF on an unexpanded VIC, otherwise it is at $9400-95FF.

http://sleepingelephant.com/denial/wiki/index.php?title=Memory_Map
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ral-clan
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Postby ral-clan » Sat Jan 17, 2009 9:29 am

Started an article on the VIC-1540 floppy disk drive.

http://sleepingelephant.com/denial/wiki/index.php?title=VIC-1540_disk_drive

...welcome any additions, especially filling out the technical / electronic / CBM DOS information, which is my weak area.

Article on the VIC-1541 to come later.

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Postby ral-clan » Sun Feb 01, 2009 1:37 pm

Hi! I've created an article on VIC-20 keyboards:

http://sleepingelephant.com/denial/wiki ... e=Keyboard

I'd like someone with technical knowledge to add info about keyboard matrices, the chips that control it, etc.

I've read this thread, but some of it's above my head:

http://sleepingelephant.com/ipw-web/bul ... ght=matrix

That's the kind of info that would be nice in this article.

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ral-clan
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Postby ral-clan » Wed Feb 04, 2009 9:47 am

Started articles for the VIC-1011A RS232 adapter:

http://sleepingelephant.com/denial/wiki/index.php?title=VIC-1011A_RS232C_adapter

...and for the VIC-1011B.

http://sleepingelephant.com/denial/wiki/index.php?title=VIC-1011B_RS232C_adapter

Its very basic at the moment. I don't know much about these interfaces and there is little info on the web (particularly about the difference betwee current loop and terminal type interfaces - and what each is used for).

Also, I don't even have a picture of the VIC-1001B itself. If anyone who owns one could supply a picture, I would appreciate it. Thanks.

Also, please feel free to add to the article (especially technical info) if you are knowledgeable (or just tell me what you'd like me to add if you don't want to do it).

I would also like to know if these devices can be used on a C64 so I can add that info to the article.

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Postby ral-clan » Thu Feb 05, 2009 11:23 am

New articles (please correct or add info if you can):

VIC-1110 8K RAM expander cartridge:
http://sleepingelephant.com/denial/wiki/index.php?title=VIC-1110

VIC-1111 16K RAM expander cartridge:
http://sleepingelephant.com/denial/wiki/index.php?title=VIC-1111

VIC-1210 3K RAM expander cartridge:
http://sleepingelephant.com/denial/wiki/index.php?title=VIC-1210

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carlsson
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Postby carlsson » Fri Feb 06, 2009 2:05 am

I might ask Stonan if he still has that boxed (!) VIC-1011B (I sold him) and can take some pictures.

As for the difference between terminal type and current loop, I think the former outputs a voltage for every bit while current loop breaks the current when "0" bits are sent. It should be looked up and validated before insert to the wiki. Apart from Teletype terminals, I don't know what can be used with a 1011B, most other RS-232 devices (modems, printers etc) tend to be "terminal type".
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ral-clan
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Postby ral-clan » Fri Feb 06, 2009 6:19 am

carlsson wrote:I might ask Stonan if he still has that boxed (!) VIC-1011B (I sold him) and can take some pictures.


That would be great. Even a Google image search turns up NOTHING on the 1011B.

As for the difference between terminal type and current loop, I think the former outputs a voltage for every bit while current loop breaks the current when "0" bits are sent. It should be looked up and validated before insert to the wiki. Apart from Teletype terminals, I don't know what can be used with a 1011B, most other RS-232 devices (modems, printers etc) tend to be "terminal type".


Oh....okay. This is different (opposite?) to what you said in an old post I found (which was one of the few sources of info on the differences between the two). I think in the old post you said the current loop of the 1011B was more suitable for printers.

carlsson wrote:Posted: Fri Sep 09, 2005 5:54 am Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

There are some terminal programs on Funet, but I've never tried it. You are lucky to have the 1011A variant (terminal type), which allows connecting a modem. I have the 1011B variant (current loop) which is more for parallel printers IIRC.

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Postby carlsson » Fri Feb 06, 2009 7:07 am

Frankly I don't know one way or another. :-) The only thing I am quite confident about is that current loop interfaces were used with Teletypes, which indeed is a kind of printer. Of course teleprinters predate the VIC-20 by decades, so the need to support such equipment would probably have been due to legacy systems.

Basically, I think the B-type is mostly unusable with the kind of RS-232 peripherals you would like to be able to connect.
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ral-clan
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Postby ral-clan » Tue Feb 10, 2009 12:47 pm

I've started an article on the VIC-1112 IEEE-488 interface cartridge:

http://sleepingelephant.com/denial/wiki/index.php?title=VIC-1112_IEEE-488_interface_cartridge

Information on the cartridge is scarce. The manual has never been archived. Unfortunately, my knowledge of it this device is superficial.

So, if you have any info/photos/manuals, etc. regarding this cartridge please contact me. If you can think you can improve the article - PLEASE DO SO!

Thanks!


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