Jeff's VIC 20 Book

[Lechuck]

$30 sounds good. Even with any extra import duty at my end, I'd just like to get my hands on a nice copy. Please let me/us know when we can put the order in and where.

I’m also OK with that

Cheers

[Jeff-20]

Shipping is crazy. Media rates only seem to be available for domestic mail. I am still investigating ways to bring the international price down.
...
Here's what the final prices would be:

UPDATE:
I was wrong. A decade ago, I shipped all Denial members gift packaages of game tapes and disks. It wasn't very difficult. May have been kinda cheap if I remember correctly. Time changes everything. Anyway, to get to the point: I have to suspend international distribution until I can find a printer in Europe and Canada.

I took real packages and addresses to the post office today. After an infuriating day of filling out customs forms, I was told the shipping information given to me online is out-of-date. I was told the cheapest international shipping for a book (media, 12 ounces/ 340 grams) to Canada is $23... That's 8 hours away from me. If anyone wants to explore other options, here are the full specs in US and metric: 10.5 x 7.5 inches x 0.2 inches, 12 oz... 267mm x 191mm x 5mm, 340 grams. Tarriff code 4901 for books.

Europe was obviously more, and prices go up from there all the way to $90. This is obviously impossible now (rant: I feel like we are in a time actively discouraging tangible international exchange.) Prices mentioned above are not possible. The total price would be more like $40-45 usd outside of the USA. I cannot justify that price. But hope is not lost...

So, here is my idea: if anyone wants to take the burden of distributiing in their continent, I can send you the exact files and specifications and help you research a printer in your area. Printing one book here is expensive ($35), but if you are willing to print 10 books, the price goes down to about $10 per book.

This could be a lot to ask, but shiping within your continent is obviously cheaper and faster. If you think you can find 5 to 10 persons in your country or nearby countries, you have my blessing (and gratitude) to organize and distribute books where you are.

I hope this is not too disappointing. I am open to any other ideas or suggestions, but at the moment it looks like I will be stuck shipping within the USA only unless someone comes up with a better solution or someone is willing to pay outrageous shipping for a long wait. Sorry.

[srowe]

So, here is my idea: if anyone wants to take the burden of distributiing in their continent, I can send you the exact files and specifications and help you research a printer in your area. Printing one book here is expensive ($35), but if you are willing to print 10 books, the price goes down to about $10 per book.

I'm happy to cover the UK, and probably Channel Islands/IoM (but probably not the Republic Of Ireland). I did a quick quote on a couple of web sites and got varying prices (but I was guessing at the spec). Let me know the details and approx numbers.

Simon

[Jeff-20]

You're awesome! I would suggest polling for people in your general area range. Perhaps modify the specs to be cost effective for a very small batch.

My printer was all in American units, so I am just estimating standard metrics.

Code: Select all

"Digest" size 5.5"x8.5" inches (21.59 x 13.97 cm) 
128 pages, 
Wire-O ( Wire-O color: White) 
portrait Paper: 100lb. (150 gsm)
Text . Gloss. 
Printing: Throughout: one color, black only.

Cover: ( 4 additional sides, full color). 
Paper: 130lb. (350 gsm)
Cover Gloss Gloss Lamination laminated.

[srowe]

Could anyone in Great Britain & NI who is interested in a copy PM me so I get an idea of numbers?

Simon

[tokra]

Hmm, I checked the USPS-site and entered your dimensions. The the cheapest I could find was "First-Class Mail International" ($13.50 to Germany, $6.03 to Canada).

https://www.usps.com/international/firs ... tional.htm

You can try yourself here:

https://postcalc.usps.com/

Value: 0$
HS-Tariff Number: 49019900
Weight: 1 pound
In the bottom choose "Calculate price based on Shape and Size" - NOT "flat-rate envelopes" - it only shows the expensive priority ones there.
Then "Large Envelope"
Then "None of the following"

Finallly at the very bottom is the $13.50 option. Do not trust the post office people or even the website to point you to the cheapest option. You have to actively search for those. They always try to sell you their "priority"-options.

I think you have to use these special envelopes and not use self-packed packages, though. I remember back in the time of video-tape-trading with US-guys this was always the cheapest option as well.

[srowe]

Using an estimate print run of 10 I've got a quote of just under £5 for Jeff's specification, looks like postage would be £3. There would then be a donation on top of that.

[Jeff-20]

Hmm, I checked the USPS-site and entered your dimensions. The the cheapest I could find was "First-Class Mail International" ($13.50 to Germany, $6.03 to Canada).
...
Finallly at the very bottom is the $13.50 option. Do not trust the post office people or even the website to point you to the cheapest option. You have to actively search for those. They always try to sell you their "priority"-options.

I think you have to use these special envelopes and not use self-packed packages, though. I remember back in the time of video-tape-trading with US-guys this was always the cheapest option as well.

Thank you for double checking. These are exactly the same prices I was getting! I was told international shipping was out of date or "no longer correct"... with a long line behind me, I could only debate the issue for so long. They were quite aggressive (rude?) in asserting lower prices for international mail no longer exist. I haven't done a mass international mailing in a long time, so I respected their authority.

I mailed two domestic orders for the $3.65, the same price I saw online. And I decided to return the day (today) with a screenshot of what the online system calculates (I also took a pic of the prices the employees insisted were the minimum now).

"First Class Package International" should be "First Class Mail International"

Using an estimate print run of 10 I've got a quote of just under £5 for Jeff's specification, looks like postage would be £3. There would then be a donation on top of that.

Thanks for researching this! I still think local printing would be a good idea. I knew printing could be much cheaper elsewhere... China for example, could make a book that would cost almost nothing. I encourage anyone interested in doing so, to explore the options available in your area. My printing prices are a little highter because I went with some personal options (vegetable inks and recycled paper, etc.)

Let's say international shipping is under investigation at the moment. I really think a proper solution with the shipping could bring the prices back to the original quote I gave -- under 20 for everyone, everywhere. I'll go back to the post office and update here.

[Jeff-20]

Ok, here's the story of my day so far.

First visit (you know this is going to be bad if there's more than one visit), I waited in a long line with all docs completed and asked a manager(?) on my turn. They told me padded envelopes are considered packages. They inspected my mailers, then showed me an acceptable plain mailers. So, I left and went out to buy some.

Second visit, I returned with 6.5 x 9.5 inch manilla envelops. Waited in the line again. On my turn, I was told they could feel the subtle groves of a spiral and do not consider that a document. Anything outside of paper turns a 13.50 shipping price to a $23 shipping price. I asked if that would include any kind of paperclip or staple. The lady said it didn't quite seem flexible enough (and seemed to doubt it was actually just paper). She begrudgingly decided to accept them with a warning that she expected them to be lost or returned to me. It felt quite personal in that she double checked the $6 Canadian postage because it didn't seem like enough for international shipping costs. My receipt now shows the Canadian package somehow weighs more than the first two despite identical contents.

So, here's the idea. I mailed 5 so far. 2 domestic in padded envelops (I'll PM tracking numbers), and 3 international mailers (not padded, sigh). I want to wait and see what happens to these packages IF they arrive and what condition they arrive in. I wil PM tracking numbers to the recipients, ask them to post here when their books arrive. There are no tracking numbers for the international mail.

At the moment, I really like the idea of encouraging others to print locally if bulk printing and domestic shipping reduces the price for all. I can send all files you need, and one could modify the specs for personal tastes.

[Lechuck]

Thanks a lot for all your efforts, Jeff. Let’s see what happens with those international sendings…

Cheers

[AndyH]

What a nightmare. I wonder if it might be easier to put the books up on ebay (with mark up to cover their fees) and use their global shipping program? I've had a couple of good experiences with US sellers doing this, although it's not as cheap as your original quotes, it wasn't silly postage.

[Mayhem]

Yeah it's something daft with USPS in general regarding envelopes. As soon as there's cardboard backing inside, or it's a bubble mailer, it instantly turns it from letter to package if the envelope size is above around 6" x 8".

[mathom]

Just got my book! It arrived in perfect condition. The package was small enough to fit in my mailbox so they didn’t have to leave it at the door where the local porch pirates would have a shot at it.

The book looks just great! I’m sure it will receive heavy use.

EDIT: Just noticed that the wire binding did get slightly bent/crushed. Not enough to notice at first glance and it in no way affects the ability to open the book and lay it flat or fold it backward.

[mythic66]

@Jeff I'm interested to get one copy, I'm in Canada. Maybe I missed something in the thread but I can't find the
way to proceed.

thanks for your good work !

[Jeff-20]

@Jeff I'm interested to get one copy, I'm in Canada. Maybe I missed something in the thread but I can't find the
way to proceed.

Thanks for your interest in the project. We are still trying to figure out how to deliver them at a reasonable cost. We may need to set up a Canadian distributor. I’ll update you soon.

Just got my book! It arrived in perfect condition.
…
EDIT: Just noticed that the wire binding did get slightly bent/crushed. Not enough to notice at first glance and it in no way affects the ability to open the book and lay it flat or fold it backward.

Again, thanks for the update! I’m very curious to see how the condition of the less padded international bound books. Still hoping they just arrive at all.

Hey, everyone. I’ve been exploring the idea of going back to the Amazon route. I think I can get a coil book to everyone that wanted one, but I will have to rearrange the document to make it acceptable for an Amazon traditional binding (perfect bound with no inside cover print). The good side is all of these will be printed in your local area, super inexpensive, and be delivered quickly. The paper will be thin and matte, but the contents will be easy to update should the need arise.