Denial

I've worked on small pieces of software, such as simple games, for other machines, but I've always wanted to know how to create games or more complex programs for my VIC. I've attempted to create things for my VIC before, but I could never really find the information I needed to create games and other programs.

So, I was wondering if anyone could give about any good first steps in creating VIC-20 software. Anything would help.

Do you want to develop in BASIC or Assembler?


I develop normally not on the VIC but on the VICE for my VIC. After developing and first tests I'm testing software on a real VIC.

What kind of information would you be looking for? Memory maps, chip documentation, Basic documentation, file formats and so on. I'm afraid there is no common magic way to write software. Which "other machines" do you have experience of? What consists of a more complex program?

Diddl's advice of cross developing is a very good one. I think the vast majority of VIC programmers (and probably also other systems) are cross developing these days. Debugging sessions in the emulator, then move over to real hardware for final testing.

carlsson wrote:I think the vast majority of VIC programmers (and probably also other systems) are cross developing these days. Debugging sessions in the emulator, then move over to real hardware for final testing.

Really?

Jeff-20 wrote:Really?

Yes!

Diddl wrote: Yes!

really??

Actually I can name two people who work directly on a real VIC-20. One would be Jeff and another would be an Italian guy who communicates through e-mail rather than forum posts.

Is there anyone that does ML development on a real VIC-20? I've always thought that would be really fun. Not very practical I suppose. VASM is really the only option, and it's pretty limited with 22 collumns, label names, etc. Fine for testing code, but for a full project a bit limiting.

Why programming for the Vic-20? Maybe because the limitations are challenging? Well, not using anything but a real Vic-20 for development is also a challenge!

yes, but coding is difficult enough (for me), I don't have do increase difficulty by doing it on a VIC ...

I would think the biggest reason for not coding on an actual VIC-20 would be portability. You can take your notebook anywhere to work on your program. A VIC might be a little more difficult to tote around in your book bag.

Heather

We shouldn't forget, that the OP was not only asking about cross-developing vs. developing on the VIC-20 itself, but asking about a programmers' reference for the VIC-20 in general.

And complaining about the perceived lack of information about that in the 'net. Which I have difficulties to understand, as exactly these three keywords: "VIC-20", "programmers", "reference" turn out an excellent hit on ftp.zimmers.net as first link on G**gle.

As carlsson already pointed out:

carlsson wrote:I'm afraid there is no common magic way to write software.

The VIC-20 Programmers' Reference Manual gives a good overview about the technical aspects. And if the OP is on solid ground with:

Ihavenousername wrote:I've worked on [...] software [...] for other machines

... the rest is a simple matter of knowledge transfer.

Perhaps the next mega project should be a Games Creator.

I feel profoundly sad right now.

Carlsson,

do you have the game creator for the Vic20?

It came with 3 sprite type games : Kanga, Zyon, Crazy Maze.

I think the authors were the Darling brothers, I will check tomorrow.

It has screen, graphics and sound designers.

p.s. I have coded on a Vic Emulator on my windows mobile! The keyboard is a bit of a pain but it worked and was portable.