Simulate PC ESC and Arrow keys on a Commodore for telecom?

rwv01 · Post by **rwv01** » Wed Dec 17, 2008 5:26 am

I'm finding navigation difficult on some BBS from my Commodores
because the remote computer assumes I'm using a PC
and asks me to hit "escape", or use my arrow keys to navigate.

Any way to have a Vic or C64 send the correct codes
to the remote computer expecting PC type escape and arrow keys?

Could it be done via a software wedge some how?
or ASCII codes?
It would have to work in combination with a terminal
program and a modem.

ral-clan · Post by **ral-clan** » Wed Dec 17, 2008 8:26 am

Are there no simple VT-100 terminal emulators for the VIC-20? (I'm assuming the VT-100 standard terminal would have all these keys).

rwv01 · Post by **rwv01** » Wed Dec 17, 2008 12:54 pm

VT-100, Hum? (searches)
As in VT-100 ANSI escape sequences?
Well, there's... (searches again) Mighty Term.

So now the question is what are the sequences and how to use them with
a Vic/C64.

I wonder if I can set up the escape sequenses as macros sent from my
CardCo 10-key pad? It can enter a user defined sequence of characters with one key press via a software wedge.
Can it work with a terminal emulator? Guess I'll have to try it.

Schema · Post by **Schema** » Wed Dec 17, 2008 2:25 pm

Presumably the terminal program would do the mapping for you.

rwv01 · Post by **rwv01** » Thu Dec 18, 2008 8:03 am

Yeah presumably.
If so then I just don't know how to use them.
Perhaps I could contact the authors.

orion70 · Post by **orion70** » Thu Dec 18, 2008 9:10 am

Probably this has nothing to do with what you're looking for, but in the Zimmers archive I found this Character translation configuration program for Mighty Term. When run, it looks for a printer, so I used the VICE emulated one to produce this output. See if it can help - unfortunately, it's in UPPER+lower case, and the printer emu is upper only, thus it's not so readable.

Also, googling around I found this thread in comp.sys.cbm where some Denialers are involved

.

rwv01 · Post by **rwv01** » Fri Dec 19, 2008 9:45 am

Wow you went to a lot of trouble to answer my question!
I appreciate that. The program may prove useful. I have a 1525 printer
so I should be able to do a printout from my Vic.

The "CardKey macro" idea (see above) didn't work.

If Mighty Term (or any VT100 terminal emulator) supports VT100 escape sequences, presumably they'd be mapped to certain keys by that program, as Schema said. So the question is are they actually supported, and what are the keys used?

Also, to what extent does the system you're contacting support them?

Here's some info about ACEterm that's relevant to this issue.
http://www.csbruce.com/~csbruce/cbm/ace/term-doc.html

ral-clan · Post by **ral-clan** » Fri Dec 19, 2008 10:01 am

This may be a naive question, but aren't there already a whole bunch of standard Control codes for use in a terminal environment that will accomplish what you are trying to do?

I remember that CTRL-C breaks, and CTRL-G causes a bell sound for instance.

CTRL-M does something else, like line break.

http://bash-hackers.org/wiki/doku.php/s ... minalcodes

The article in the link above says that the Control code for the "Escape" character is CTRL-LEFT BRACKET (^[).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Control_character

I wonder if some of these control codes would work for you. I remember using them when using terminal programs to access BBS systems in the 1980s.

You can just enter them manual by using combined keypresses (CTRL + key) or if you could find a terminal program for the VIC that would allow key macros to be set up on the function keys, you could even put these CTRL codes into the macro "slots". The latter solution could allow the function keys to act as the Esc, cursor movement keys, etc. in a terminal environment.

rwv01 · Post by **rwv01** » Fri Dec 19, 2008 6:58 pm

ral-clan wrote:This may be a naive question, but aren't there already a whole bunch of standard Control codes for use in a terminal environment that will accomplish what you are trying to do?

Control Codes! Thanks!
I'm the naive one! That's what I should have been
looking for! A search for "Terminal+control+codes" brings up
pages that list the keys to use. Ctrl+M is a carriage return.
And it works in Novaterm. Haven't tried it in Mighty Term yet.
Now my homework's cut out for me.

ral-clan · Post by **ral-clan** » Sat Dec 20, 2008 9:56 am

Great....I love it when old 80s knowledge helps out in a modern situation (my dusty knowledge of UNIX shell commands and MS-DOS has helped me so many times..."young 'uns" weaned on Windows GUI like interfaces look at a command shell or a terminal program like it's some sort of alien interface)!

rwv01 · Post by **rwv01** » Sat Dec 20, 2008 5:39 pm

Yeah. We've had our Vic since 1982, but my knowledge of it was pretty basic back then.

Mighty Term does support these control codes.
So does Novaterm. Still have to play with them more online
with another system.

ral-clan · Post by **ral-clan** » Sun Dec 21, 2008 8:14 am

rwv01 wrote:Mighty Term does support these control codes.
So does Novaterm. Still have to play with them more online
with another system.

I don't think it's your computer's terminal program that needs to support these Control Codes. It's the hosting system (i.e. the BBS or mainframe) that you log onto that needs to be able to interpret what the Control Code means.

The VIC's terminal program just transmits a string of characters "CTRL-whatever". It's a dumb terminal.

rwv01 · Post by **rwv01** » Sun Dec 21, 2008 2:53 pm

Yeah, and that's what I'm trying to figgure out now.
I've been trying out the codes on Seattle Community Network (1-206-386-4199). It's a Unix system that has a lot of features including accsess to the textbased web browser Lynx. Ctrl+M seems to do a carrige return. like hitting "return". Ctrl+G does the "Bell" (what's that for anyway?) Still can't move the cursor for some reason. I'll go to a section where it says "Use your arrow keys to move" but they don't move the cursor.
The codes don't seem to do it either.

Cursor moving
According to this page: http://ascii-table.com/ansi-escape-sequences-vt-100.php

Esc+A Move cursor up one line (cursor up)
Esc+B Move cursor down one line (cursor dn)
Esc+C Move cursor right one char (cursor rt)
Esc+D Move cursor left one char (cursor lf)
Esc+H Move cursor to upper left corner (cursor home)

But what exactly are the keys to use on a Vic or C64?

ral-clan · Post by **ral-clan** » Sun Dec 21, 2008 2:55 pm

Try using the left pointing arrow key on a Commodore VIC-20 or C64 in place of the Escape key. This key is the one in the upper left corner of the keyboard.

rwv01 · Post by **rwv01** » Sun Dec 21, 2008 3:20 pm

Ok, Thanks I'll try that after work and see what happens.