cart information

[brain]

Is there a discussion thread or reference that discusses the various legal configurations for game and utility/RAM carts?

I tried wading through the BehrBonz and MegaCart threads, but so much information is suppressed, I can't begin to get technical details.

Jim

[eslapion]

Is there a discussion thread or reference that discusses the various legal configurations for game and utility/RAM carts?

I tried wading through the BehrBonz and MegaCart threads, but so much information is suppressed, I can't begin to get technical details.

Jim

Would you care to elaborate on the term "legal" ?

The Behr Bonz schematic is based on the fact that no cartridge that is documented uses both BLK2 and BLK5 at the same time.

The same applies to BLK1 and BLK3.

Now, I am talking ROM only, of course... a 24k RAM cart WILL use BLK1 and 3 at the same time and a 32k RAM cart will use all 4 at the same time.

Also, personally, I don't know of any utility cart that will put ROM in BLK1 or 2 and that's why the Ultimate Expander offers ROM options in BLK3 and 5 only.

[carlsson]

Some utility cartridges are only 4K though, and designed in such way that with a cartridge expander you should be able to plug in both within the same 8K block.

[Boray]

Maybe he is talking about the fact that you are selling hundreds of copyrighted games without any legal rights to do that.

[brain]

At this time, I was using "legal" in the "legal opcodes" sense. In other words, what configurations are valid or used by games. Is there any reason to turn on RAM1 but not RAM2 at the same time, for instance?

I was looking for the matrix:

Code: Select all

none
std cart:  BLK5ROM
8k ram:  BLK1RAM
16k:       BLK1RAM,BLK2RAM
24K...
27k....
weirdcart:  blk2ROM,BLK5ROM,RAM1
etc.

stuff like that. I'm curious about the internals of the various carts being created here.

Jim

[carlsson]

Well, eslapion quite well described the actual situation:

BLK1 + BLK2: no known examples
BLK1 + BLK3: no known examples
BLK1 + BLK5: Donkey Kong, Dig Dug, Dancing Bear + some more?
BLK2 + BLK3: Scott Adams' adventure series
BLK2 + BLK5: no known exemples
BLK3 + BLK5: All other 16K cartridges

There may be some 4K or 8K cartridges which map individually into BLK1, 2 or 3 but I don't think in combination with another block.

RAM expansions is another matter. The typical ones are BLK1, BLK1 + BLK2 or BLK1 + BLK2 + BLK3.

[Mayhem]

BLK1 + BLK5: Donkey Kong, Dig Dug, Dancing Bear + some more?

I have the following down as attaching something to BLK1 in GB20: Cannonball Blitz, Centipede, Dancing Bear, Dig Dug, Donkey Kong and Lunar Leeper.

[eslapion]

Well, eslapion quite well described the actual situation:

BLK1 + BLK2: no known examples
BLK1 + BLK3: no known examples
BLK1 + BLK5: Donkey Kong, Dig Dug, Dancing Bear + some more?
BLK2 + BLK3: Scott Adams' adventure series
BLK2 + BLK5: no known exemples
BLK3 + BLK5: All other 16K cartridges

There may be some 4K or 8K cartridges which map individually into BLK1, 2 or 3 but I don't think in combination with another block.

RAM expansions is another matter. The typical ones are BLK1, BLK1 + BLK2 or BLK1 + BLK2 + BLK3.

Add to that that all known 4k or 8k games carts go into BLK 5, some utility carts use all or half of BLK5 (Super Expander and Basic V4 is $A000-$AFFF, there is a version of VICMON which is $B000-$BFFF, HESMON uses all of BLK5) and there are a couple of utility carts which use only one half of BLK3, (Programmer's Aid and one version of the Rabbit tape accelerator reside in $7000-$7FFF and the original VICMON is located at $6000-$6FFF).

Utility carts don't tend to use BLK1 or 2 to avoid conflicting with RAM expansion, I suppose.

[carlsson]

On Zimmers there is at least one version of VICMON relocated to $4000 but it could be a hacked version.

[orion70]

From the VIC-20 Cartridge Rarity & Gameplay listing (1998):

BLK1 + BLK2: no known examples

Daedalus, Baldor's Castle, 12k(*) BLK1+BLK2 (SYS20182)

From Cartzilla:

The location of the game was also unusual for a cartridge, though not unusual for a game written in Basic. The author apparently just copied the image from his 16k RAM expander's memory area to that same memory area on an (EP)ROM cartridge format. Only this game and the Scott Adams games require a SYS number to start and both because they sit in the area normally used by Basic programs.

BLK1 + BLK5: Donkey Kong, Dig Dug, Dancing Bear + some more?

Atarisoft, Centipede, 16k BLK1+BLK5
Sierra, Lunar Leeper, 12k(*) BLK1+BLK5
Sierra, Cannonball Blitz, 12k(*) BLK1+BLK5

(*) shouldn't they be 16K?

[6502dude]

Sierra, Lunar Leeper, 12k(*) BLK1+BLK5
Sierra, Cannonball Blitz, 12k(*) BLK1+BLK5

(*) shouldn't they be 16K?

They only use 12K of 16K for code.
On MegaCart, the "extra 4k" is used for additional games/utilities within 16K space.

[Mayhem]

You obviously missed my post above Orion

[orion70]

Yep, I should learn to keep reading the whole thread and not only the first posts.

[carlsson]

Daedalus, Baldor's Castle

That one was unknown to me. Is it confirmed to have been a commercial cartridge or just something homemade?

It also makes me wonder when you boot a VIC-20 with a 8K ROM cartridge in block 1, does the VIC automatically rearrange the screen matrix to $1000 but remain at 3583 bytes free since the contents of block 1 isn't writable RAM?

[orion70]

Is it confirmed to have been a commercial cartridge or just something homemade?

I don't know. It is indicated as "extremely rare" in Ward Shrake's VIC-20 Cartridge Rarity & Gameplay listing.
I tried a google search, but no luck: the only info available is Daedalus, 1983, by Martin Kennedy. No images of the cartridge and/or its box.