Behr-Bonz 2015

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eslapion
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Re: Behr-Bonz 2015

Post by eslapion »

@akator
Take a look at the presently included 127 titles ( http://sleepingelephant.com/ipw-web/bul ... 68&start=3 ) and tell me what's missing...
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akator
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Re: Behr-Bonz 2015

Post by akator »

I don't think anything is lacking from the Behr-Bonz as a compilation of the classic VIC game carts.

Maybe the "Extra Bonz" could keep the classic carts in the first 127 slots and fill the next 127 with more recent software like some of the awesome games released here at Denial over the last several years.
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Re: Behr-Bonz 2015

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akator wrote:Maybe the "Extra Bonz" could keep the classic carts in the first 127 slots and fill the next 127 with more recent software like some of the awesome games released here at Denial over the last several years.
The Behr-Bonz can be as lean as it is in terms of electronic components for a very important reason: Games published as cartridges in the early 1980s follow a very strict set of rules with regards to the memory areas they use.

I will try to describe them here but I do remember I posted them elsewhere so don't be too stern on me if I don't give them exactly the same way or in a different order.

1. Games only take up 4k, 8k or 16k
2. All autostart games first use BLK5 then use BLK1 or 3 - they never use BLK2 - games of more than 8k use BLK 1 or 3, never both
3. Non autostart games first use BLK2 then use BLK3 - they never use BLK5 (they could use BLK 1 and 2 only but none does)
4. Cart games never need RAM expansion (auto-start or not)

So I took the largest EPROM I could find (the 27C160 is a 16Mbit - 2MBytes chip) and divided it into 128 sections of 16k by connecting the top 7 address lines to an octal flip-flop which can be set by just poking a value ($00 to $7F ) to any IO3 address. The very first 16k section is occupied by the menu leaving 127 sections for the games. The 8th flip-flop in the octal flip-flop is used to create a locking system which prevents games which poke garbage into the IO ranges from dismounting the selected game. Once a game is selected only a reset of the flip-flop can send you back to the menu and that's why a normal reset of the VIC will only restart the selected game.

I can add another set of 127 games by changing the 8th flip-flop to another address lines on a 32Mbit flash memory chip and using a pair of unused inverters as the new lock. However the same set of rules still apply if I were to add new games; they must be no larger than 16k and they must use memory areas in the same arrangement as the old games. AFAIK, there are not too many new games which respect these rules.
Last edited by eslapion on Tue Jul 19, 2016 2:40 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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akator
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Re: Behr-Bonz 2015

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^ That's what I thought :)
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Misfit
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Re: Behr-Bonz 2015

Post by Misfit »

eslapion wrote:if I were to add new games; they must be no larger than 16k and they must use memory areas in the same arrangement as the old games. AFAIK, there are not too many new games which respect these rules.
A very stupid OT question: How much it would cost if you would make a new game cartridge (a new VIC-20 game and a 16k cartridge)?
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eslapion
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Re: Behr-Bonz 2015

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Misfit wrote:A very stupid OT question: How much it would cost if you would make a new game cartridge (a new VIC-20 game and a 16k cartridge)?
Let me rephrase what I understand her:

How much would it cost to make a new game cartridge?

IMHO, the cheapest way to make a single new 16k game cart is to use a faulty game cart and replace the two 2364 ROMs in it with a pair of MCM68764 and that's 14$US.

If you're starting from scratch then that greatly depends on the number of units you want to produce. If you make 30 units or more than I would guess about 10$US each. You make a new PCB and can use cheaper 27CXXX PROMs in that case. This does not include the plastic case.

BTW: This is not a stupid question at all.
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joshuadenmark
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Re: Behr-Bonz 2015

Post by joshuadenmark »

Cartridge received, arrived safely today, thanks for well packed shipping of this gemstone.
image.jpg
Kind regards, Peter.
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eslapion
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Re: Behr-Bonz 2015

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@joshuadenmark
Glad to be at your service!
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eslapion
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Re: Behr-Bonz 2015

Post by eslapion »

There has been a (not so) gentleman on another forum nagging me about the Behr-Bonz failing "spectacularly" on a PAL VIC-20cr.

Since I sold a bunch of these carts to European users, can anyone here tell me if there is any problem with any game with the Behr-Bonz on a PAL VIC-20cr ?

I checked as much as I could on my side and found nothing wrong...
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Re: Behr-Bonz 2015

Post by mrr19121970 »

No issues at all 2 prong, CR all working fine.
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Re: Behr-Bonz 2015

Post by elwee »

I can confirm no issues so far on a PAL VC20CR.
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Re: Behr-Bonz 2015

Post by elwee »

@eslapion: To prove it, it would be helpful to let us europeans know more details on "failing spectacularly" ... only if available, of course :)
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Re: Behr-Bonz 2015

Post by vicist »

Works flawlessly on my 2 prong and cr Vics. :D

Guy must have some issue with his expansion port.
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Re: Behr-Bonz 2015

Post by mrr19121970 »

Maybe he ESD zapped it?

When are we going to find out more about the 2016 model? I'll pre order if there is enough reason to buy (more features)
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eslapion
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Re: Behr-Bonz 2015

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elwee wrote:@eslapion: To prove it, it would be helpful to let us europeans know more details on "failing spectacularly" ... only if available, of course :)
I guess that's a question for 'dudz' on Melon64 but he's the kind of character who simply seems proud to say that one of my cartridges "failed spectacularly" on a PAL VIC-20cr and give absolutely no detail...
Guy must have some issue with his expansion port.
Judging by the kind of comments he posted on Melon64, he must also have a bunch of issues somewhere between the left and right ear...
When are we going to find out more about the 2016 model? I'll pre order if there is enough reason to buy (more features)
Considering the price of the UltiMem, it's not really possible for me to offer a lot more features and stay competitive.

I would like to know if my answers to some of your previous request concerning the reset button, fallback to normal BASIC and others did help you get more out of your Behr-Bonz ?

There is a "hidden" extra feature I could include but it would truly only benefit users of multislot expanders.

Let me explain:
Because it tries to mimic the memory areas usage of most autostart games and scott adams games, the Behr-Bonz occupies a available BLK areas (1,2,3 and 5). If you have a multislot expander, you can prevent the menu and autostart games from running when you turn on your VIC by disabling the BLK5 area of the slot in which you plugged the Behr-Bonz - the menu code is still available mirrored at BLK2.

Now, there are manu games on the Behr-Bonz which take up only 4k or 8k and so the other half of the 16k cell which shows up at BLK1 and BLK3 is just empty. I could put stuff like VICMON, Programmer's Aid, SJLOAD or other utilities in some of these unused half cells.

You can access the desired cell which contains the utility of your choice by manually doing what the menu does, just poke the cell number into the 1st address of IO3 (POKE39936,#)

The autostart game which normally appears at BLK5 will now be mirrored at BLK2 and the utility will show up at BLK1 and BLK3.
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