Load VIC-20 Tape Images

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Dr-D
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Load VIC-20 Tape Images

Postby Dr-D » Fri Mar 20, 2015 10:13 pm

I've downloaded the SD2IEC collection and found a gazillion VIC-20 tape images. My question is how can I actually load them with my VIC-20 rather than the emulator on my PC?

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beamrider
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Re: Load VIC-20 Tape Images

Postby beamrider » Sat Mar 21, 2015 10:38 am

Well there are several ways, here are the most convenient in ascending order of cost..

A mobile phone or tablet running Android and an mp3 caassete adapter.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Car-Cassette-Tape-Adapter-for-iPhone-3G-4G-MP3-iPod-Nano-CD-Cassete-Black-UK-/201017808319?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item2ecd9855bf

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=co.kica.tapdancer&hl=en

..transfer the .tap images to your phone and load using the software playing into your datasette.


This is a simialar idea, but maybe a bit more reliable

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Commodore-64-uCassette-The-Only-Datassette-Player-Emulator-/321693436544?_trksid=p2054897.l4275



The deluxe solution is to buy on of these...

http://www.manosoft.it/?p=1198

.. this also acts as an sd2iec allowing you to load .prg, .d64 etc...



Or course, if you don't need to recreate the original tape loading experience and just want the easiest way to load Vic-20 software, one of these and an SD card is the way to go..

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Beige-SD2IEC-Commodore-1541-Disk-Drive-Emulation-SD-Card-Reader-Vic20-C128-C64-/330919501256?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item4d0c56ddc8

Hope this helps..
Last edited by beamrider on Sun Mar 22, 2015 4:20 am, edited 1 time in total.

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majikeyric
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Re: Load VIC-20 Tape Images

Postby majikeyric » Sat Mar 21, 2015 12:48 pm

I'll add that there is also the Cassiopei : http://jderogee.tripod.com/projects/Cas ... siopei.htm.

Dr-D
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Re: Load VIC-20 Tape Images

Postby Dr-D » Sat Mar 21, 2015 8:06 pm

Thanks for the replies. Right after I posted that I realized that all the tape images were also available as .PRG files which I can load from my SD2IEC device.

I have a game called Centipede which is much like Centipod but slightly different graphics and sounds. The problem with it is the joystick function doesn't work right, it fires but will only move to the right. I'd like to have it fixed but I'm not a programmer so if anyone would like to look at it and possibly fix it that would be great. I couldn't upload it here so here is a link to it.

http://www.bcstestsite.com/vic20/

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Mike
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Re: Load VIC-20 Tape Images

Postby Mike » Sun Mar 22, 2015 5:15 am

Dr-D wrote:I have a game called Centipede which is much like Centipod but slightly different graphics and sounds. The problem with it is the joystick function doesn't work right, it fires but will only move to the right.

Try entering SYS65017 before actually running the game (or its main part).

Some of those games have fucked up joystick routines, that test the entire register value instead of masking out only those bits relevant to joystick directions and fire. When loaded from tape, it doesn't matter, but when loaded from disk, other bits concerned disk operation are changed in those registers, causing those routines to fail. The SYS above resets the standard register values.

You should also check this with the other games you pointed to in your other thread.

Dr-D
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Re: Load VIC-20 Tape Images

Postby Dr-D » Sun Mar 22, 2015 11:32 am

Thanks, that solved the problem for Ant Hill and Centipede but not Defender and Down Hill Skiing.

Dr-D
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Re: Load VIC-20 Tape Images

Postby Dr-D » Sun Mar 22, 2015 9:36 pm

Found a working copy of Down Hill Skiing in the SD2IEC collection.

CrossBow
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Re: Load VIC-20 Tape Images

Postby CrossBow » Thu Jan 19, 2017 12:51 pm

I realize I'm necro bumping here, but I've searched a bit and not having much luck on what I'm trying to do.

First I'm new to the Vic-20 as my wife happened upon one over the summer for about 10$ in the box. Came with an original older model vic-20, working RF adapter, power supply, and what looks like the usual bundle of tapes that likely came bundled with this vic. Oh..and the datasette of couse came with this. Everything seems to work quite well!

The datasette works well as all the actual tapes that came with this have all read so far with out issue?!

But, how does one take a TAP file or similar and convert to a wave format, that you can then playback through your PC onto an actual cassette tape and then play that tape back through the datasette to actually load up properly?

I've tried using the prg to tap..etc programs and tap to wave etc without luck. I first tried to run the MP3 conversions of these files through my mp3 player connected and then used one of those adapters that that allows you to use such a player on a tape cassette player. But no luck at all getting anything to load or be recognized? I even purchased a refurbished and fully working Bell and Howe '70s era tape cassette recorder and tried to run both the raw wave files and mp3s conversion from the line out of my SB ZX sound card in my PC to the line in on the tape recorder. Even compared the wave files between them and they are nearly dead on match?! But still I have very limited to no success in getting these copied waves to actually work on a cassette tape and through my datasette? But by god that financial program that was in the box on tape that is original will load up every time!

I'm assuming something isn't jiving in the conversion process for this to work correctly? Anyone actually tried to do this and have success?

Thanks ahead of time for reading and yes, this is my first post as I just joined the forums today.

Forbidden64
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Re: Load VIC-20 Tape Images

Postby Forbidden64 » Tue Apr 04, 2017 11:11 am

CrossBow wrote:I realize I'm necro bumping here, but I've searched a bit and not having much luck on what I'm trying to do.

First I'm new to the Vic-20 as my wife happened upon one over the summer for about 10$ in the box. Came with an original older model vic-20, working RF adapter, power supply, and what looks like the usual bundle of tapes that likely came bundled with this vic. Oh..and the datasette of couse came with this. Everything seems to work quite well!

The datasette works well as all the actual tapes that came with this have all read so far with out issue?!

But, how does one take a TAP file or similar and convert to a wave format, that you can then playback through your PC onto an actual cassette tape and then play that tape back through the datasette to actually load up properly?

I've tried using the prg to tap..etc programs and tap to wave etc without luck. I first tried to run the MP3 conversions of these files through my mp3 player connected and then used one of those adapters that that allows you to use such a player on a tape cassette player. But no luck at all getting anything to load or be recognized? I even purchased a refurbished and fully working Bell and Howe '70s era tape cassette recorder and tried to run both the raw wave files and mp3s conversion from the line out of my SB ZX sound card in my PC to the line in on the tape recorder. Even compared the wave files between them and they are nearly dead on match?! But still I have very limited to no success in getting these copied waves to actually work on a cassette tape and through my datasette? But by god that financial program that was in the box on tape that is original will load up every time!

I'm assuming something isn't jiving in the conversion process for this to work correctly? Anyone actually tried to do this and have success?

Thanks ahead of time for reading and yes, this is my first post as I just joined the forums today.



Ya, this is one of those things...I am the same way when it comes to VICing...I want my programs on real tapes. The best, and by far the cheapest solution to do it the way you are intending to do it, is with a program called 'tapdancer' which runs on droid phones in airplane mode. Run the audio line out to your mic port on the tape deck, set it around 3/4 volume or so, and around 25 on your phone(might be slightly different for your phone/deck). We already know that your datasette is in perfect working order(they always are, they are bullet proof) so that is clearly not an issue. Once you find the sweet spot, you'll have great success. If you do the same with PAL games for the 64, they will just plain not work at all. you just get a title screen and then it'll sit there at that title screen forever. Not really related I know, but that was what I was originally doing(in USA), and why I thought the method was sketchy. For VIC games, this doesn't seem to be an issue as much, possibly with the exception of very modern European additions, which tend to be exclusively for PAL, and require full ram expansions of 32k...

There actually was a cool product called a "doubler 64" which I bought several years back. Great for copying games etc. All it does is read the incoming data and record it back onto a second datasette, allowing you to copy anything. I got it so i could connect two datasettes :D.
One for programs other for data etc. So I don't have to switch out. I can't find it anymore, however...so I am very glad I didn't put off buying it. You could make one really...its just 1 datasette socket and 2 edge board connectors and some traces running together(one for the 64, and two break outs), except pin 4 on the left side for one datasette is not connected. It also comes with a tape to assist you in knowing when it is done copying/tell the datasette to start and stop etc.
Actually I found it here:
http://www.ubbcentral.com/store/item/NE ... 82908.html


The coolest and nuclear option, which will give you perfect results every time (I have never had it fail once) is the 1541 ultimate with the datasette optional attachment. You just select the tap from the menu, and select write to tape....and it just writes it to tape! Flawlessly! I use that on my commodore 64 for putting any .TAP for any commodores back onto real media. I got one of these, and I have to say, it is awesome!!! It's an REU, quad disk drive, datasette, and archiver all in one convenient cart. It can play tapes into the computer, back to tape etc. same for disks... you can make your own .TAPs, d64, d81 etc. Also has a dual SID chip emulator for all those demos I can't load because NTSC/PAL differences lol.

http://www.1541ultimate.net/content/index.php

and finally, if you want to 'reconstitute' TAPS back to tapes, you will love this site for only reasons we could...it has all the covers as well!
http://armas.cbm8bit.com/staps.html
Since finding this page...You know what I have to do... It will take me MONTHS/pounds of glossy paper/piles of strips of paper/lots of ink/and around 300 cassettes & cases. (and probably a new belt/demagnetizer for my poor datasette) although it is 30 years old and running like a champ! I just keep it demagnetized per the manual's 20 hours of use recommendation. 300 tapes, each game being maybe 2 minutes tops to load? That won't even get to a maint. point.

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Mike
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Re: Load VIC-20 Tape Images

Postby Mike » Thu Apr 06, 2017 3:41 am

I've had my share with unexpanded VIC-20 + tape in the 80ies, where I got the majority of programs and games only by typing them in from printed out listings. No urgent necessity on my side to relive that experience. :lol:

We have similar discussions here in Denial every now and then, for example in this thread: '3.5" PC floppy Drive - Convert to VIC 20/C64'. And to quote from there:

Mike wrote:SD2IEC devices give you a much easier transfer by using a storage medium which can now be accessed by both VIC-20 and PC with no further hassles. If you do not only want to play games, but seriously want to go into programming (as you've indicated somewhere else), data transfer is the last thing you want to have troubles with.

Emphasis added.

Forbidden64
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Re: Load VIC-20 Tape Images

Postby Forbidden64 » Fri Nov 03, 2017 5:28 am

well, I was offering a solution that doesn't require buying another peripheral and takes advantage of stuff he already has. The SD2EIC is a fiddly device in any case, and eats your cassette port as well as your user port. I don't have one...but I have lots of software for my VIC-20 from the internet. I just transfer it to tape, or disk. It allows me to have an authentic user experience of my Vic, as well as not costing extra money.
That said, I did spring for a 1541U2 for my commodore 64, and often use that for data transfer to tape and disk, rather than Tapdancer on my phone. I did use my phone this week though to transfer 2 games to tape. It worked flawlessly! So, there is no trouble with data transfer or reliability using tape.

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Re: Load VIC-20 Tape Images

Postby Forbidden64 » Fri Nov 03, 2017 5:41 am

Anyway, I read the other thread...typical Mike stuff. Just swat everyone's ideas down and say they aren't the best way, because it isn't your way. Then claim that posting about retro ideas in a retro forum is annoying. hahaha.

In fact, there in that thread died, possibly, a cool idea in the making before it was even conceived. Congratulations!

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beamrider
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Re: Load VIC-20 Tape Images

Postby beamrider » Fri Nov 03, 2017 5:59 am

I always found back in the day that recording on only one channel worked best. Plug your phone into the cassette deck (using a 3.5mm jack to twin phono plug lead) and record using tap-dancer connecting just one of the phono connectors.

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Mike
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Re: Load VIC-20 Tape Images

Postby Mike » Fri Nov 03, 2017 11:37 am

Forbidden64 wrote:Anyway, I read the other thread...typical Mike stuff. Just swat everyone's ideas down and say they aren't the best way, because it isn't your way. Then claim that posting about retro ideas in a retro forum is annoying. hahaha.

In fact, there in that thread died, possibly, a cool idea in the making before it was even conceived. Congratulations!

Go trolling elsewhere.


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