Denial WIKI change / addition announcement thread.

PaulQ · Post by **PaulQ** » Wed Aug 29, 2007 4:06 pm

All images I have uploaded are specifically and freely for use for the WIKI. Most of them are actually scans, and include the second Vic 20 case badge, scan of the front and back cover of the manual, scan of the expansion diagram from inside the manual, scans of all the port diagrams from the manual and the actual ports, scans of the 1530 "Square" datasette, Vicmodem, Omegarace box and cartridge, and 8k RAM expansion cartridge. That's all I can remember for now.

Oddly, I can't seem to find that image on the memory expansion page now...

ral-clan · Post by **ral-clan** » Wed Aug 29, 2007 4:14 pm

DigitalQuirk wrote:...and 8k RAM expansion cartridge. That's all I can remember for now.

Oddly, I can't seem to find that image on the memory expansion page now...

It's here

http://sleepingelephant.com/denial/wiki ... _Expansion

Thanks!

eslapion · Post by **eslapion** » Wed Aug 29, 2007 5:28 pm

ral-clan wrote:
DigitalQuirk wrote:...and 8k RAM expansion cartridge. That's all I can remember for now.

Oddly, I can't seem to find that image on the memory expansion page now...
It's here

http://sleepingelephant.com/denial/wiki ... _Expansion

Thanks!

When I go here: http://sleepingelephant.com/denial/wiki ... _Expansion

I do not find a link to (above)... it seems the page with the picture of the VIC-1110 is orphaned.

gklinger · Post by **gklinger** » Wed Aug 29, 2007 7:02 pm

eslapion wrote:When I go here: http://sleepingelephant.com/denial/wiki ... _Expansion

I do not find a link to (above)... it seems the page with the picture of the VIC-1110 is orphaned.

Try clicking on the words "Memory Expansion" and you'll get to the page with the image of the Commodore 8K RAM cartridge.

ral-clan · Post by **ral-clan** » Thu Aug 30, 2007 5:13 am

gklinger wrote:
eslapion wrote:When I go here: http://sleepingelephant.com/denial/wiki ... _Expansion

I do not find a link to (above)... it seems the page with the picture of the VIC-1110 is orphaned.
Try clicking on the words "Memory Expansion" and you'll get to the page with the image of the Commodore 8K RAM cartridge.

Correct. Clicking the "RAM Expansion" header will take you to a page describing the general principles of RAM expansion. The idea is also that each RAM expansion product listed on the peripherals page will link to its own article (like cartridges or games) providing specific info on that RAM expansion product. The specific pages would provide info like dip switch settings, manual scans, packaging scans, circuit board photos, etc. etc. that would just clutter up the main Peripherals page.

I have created a rough page for the 8K RAM cartridge to give people the idea in case they want to create other pages for peripherals, cartridges, or other products.

http://sleepingelephant.com/denial/wiki ... _Cartridge

PaulQ · Post by **PaulQ** » Thu Aug 30, 2007 1:35 pm

To be perfectly honest, I think there's too much branching going on. It confuses things. I agree to a separate page for RAM expansion, another one for storage devices, and so on...but honestly, I don't see the need to branch off more than that unless the information fills more than two pages worth.

Anyone else think this way, or am I wrong?

ral-clan · Post by **ral-clan** » Thu Aug 30, 2007 4:56 pm

I guess it comes down to the question: what's the purpose of this archive? Is it to provide generalized descriptions of things related to the VIC, like a regular Encyclopedia covering a wide range to diverse and unrelated topics, with limited space devoted to each? If that's what it's going to be then why not just leave the job up to Wikipedia?

Or is it a database to cover, in extremely minute detail, all things relating to a single topic (that being the VIC-20). I believe it is the second....it is a place to go on in extreme detail about things that would be out-of-place on the more generalized Wikipedia.

To me, that includes cover scans, complete scans of documents, etc. We are VIC collectors because we want to preserve more than general information about this computer. Frankly, we are obsessive about a 25 year old computer or we wouldn't log-on to the internet and discuss it each day. We are interested in variations in packaging, minute differences in ROMs, obscure hacks. That's a lot of information that wouldn't be of interest to readers on a Wikipedia style encyclopedia.

For instance, you certainly could have a single page for RAM expansions....but there were over 30 different RAM expansions for the VIC-20. You could simply list them all, or just say "there were also a lot of third-party RAM expanders made" and leave it at that. But as a collector, I'm quite interested in reading in detail about each one....I want to see scans for the packaging of each, a picture of the hardware, schematics of the internals, scans of the manuals, notes about how each can be hacked/modified. etc.

It would be a bit much to include all this for every one of the thirty RAM expanders in the same generic "RAM Expanders" page. Therefore I think each peripheral does warrant its own page. Same with the game cartridges. Each game should warrant its own page with box scans, instructions, reviews, etc.

I agree that as the articles, as they exist right now, are somewhat short. Some are only a paragraph long, but it would be quite easy to expand (for instance) upon the 8K RAM Cartridge to create a two page article (without even being redundant or wordy). What we have there is a start, to encourage others (with the knowledge in the various areas) to add their bits and make it that full two page article.

Anyway, in the end, it's a WIKI, so anyone can do anything to it and the most popular ideas will rule based on the Darwinian principle. I'll obviously go with the consensus. If someone wants to change it - then give it and if it works then it will stick, I suppose.

PaulQ · Post by **PaulQ** » Thu Aug 30, 2007 6:12 pm

For the record, I'm not against having a vast library of information. I just think we should follow the Wiki way and break things up once we have all that information in place. As it is, it's a bit disorienting for me to hunt down links in a paragraph or two. Then again, I am easily disoriented....

ral-clan · Post by **ral-clan** » Fri Aug 31, 2007 5:11 am

Actually, after mulling it out, I think you are right about too much branching. Short articles like the "Memory Expansion" one that give a general intro to Mem expansion can be merged onto the Peripherals page, as an intro to the the list of Ram Expansion. Good idea. I will implement that right away.

ral-clan · Post by **ral-clan** » Sun Mar 02, 2008 1:53 pm

I added some articles on the VIC-1515

http://sleepingelephant.com/denial/wiki ... ic_Printer

and VIC-1525 printers.

http://sleepingelephant.com/denial/wiki ... ic_Printer

Please feel free to edit/add if you have any relevant info.

Also, the power supply article is now nicely fleshed out:

http://sleepingelephant.com/denial/wiki ... r_Supplies

ral-clan · Post by **ral-clan** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 8:46 am

There is also this new article about the ultra-elusive VIC-1510 colour monitor:

http://sleepingelephant.com/denial/wiki ... ur_Monitor

ral-clan · Post by **ral-clan** » Sat Nov 01, 2008 9:12 am

New article about VIC-20 joysticks:

http://sleepingelephant.com/denial/wiki ... e=Joystick

(PS: Can anyone make this thread sticky like the yearly game release thread?)

ral-clan · Post by **ral-clan** » Sat Nov 01, 2008 4:56 pm

New article about VIC-20 "Wizard of Wor":

http://sleepingelephant.com/denial/wiki ... ard_of_Wor

...including some scans of an interesting 1982 price list from my collection.

ral-clan · Post by **ral-clan** » Sun Nov 02, 2008 8:28 am

New article "Ward Shrake's Datasette to Datasette modification" (with permission).

http://sleepingelephant.com/denial/wiki ... dification

Richard James · Post by **Richard James** » Sun Nov 09, 2008 6:23 am

I have started on the programming section, fleshing it out a bit. I don't want to go into too much detail yet. I just want there to be a place that people can start putting information in to.

By starting out with blank sections I hope to eventually fill it out enough that it becomes useful.