Behr-Bonz 4 game cart.

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R'zo
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Behr-Bonz 4 game cart.

Post by R'zo »

The idea of using the Behr-Bonz to print a large game on has been brought up and I am starting this thread for asking questions.

Are the 16k windows solid or can they be split up and dropped in 8k at a time?

You said flash ram can be added for save files. How would this be set up? Would it be set up to swap In and out with the other windows or would it have it's own area in ram?

If further ram expansion was added to the cart would it be capable of switching out windows as well? Could it be capable of switching 24k,32k or 35k? Or would the further expansion just be open ram for program usage?

Is there any documentation concerning the cart, it's registers and anything else that I might need to know in order to organize my data and write the routines that will run the game on the cart?

As far as can a game be organized in 16k chunks? Absolutely! If you can write an game at 5k then you can write a much larger game broken up into 16k.
With a rpg the main core of the game takes up little space. This could be done in < 16k placed in the first window. This data could then be copied placing the core routines and datake in the lower unexpanded regions of the vic.
Now all the maps, enemies, dungeon trap controls, menus, graphics, and storyline can be switched in and out as needed. Each window might contain the 16k split up with dungeon map, enemies in dungeon and there stats and data concerning items, traps, doors, puzzles and other objects and events in the dungeon.

The challenge is in making the game good enough for the price of the cart.
I think it sounds like a lot of fun. Ultimately the game has to be deigned around the cart. But the combination of the carts abilities and weaknesses will help to define the game.
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eslapion
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Re: Behr-Bonz 4 game cart.

Post by eslapion »

R'zo wrote: Are the 16k windows solid or can they be split up and dropped in 8k at a time?
The default hardware uses a 8 bit flip-flop settable through IO3 to control the upper address lines of a 16 MBit EPROM. It's the re-encoding of BLK 1,2,3 and 5 by a 74(LS or HCT)08 that causes these windows to be set up as two 8k halves visible is a pair of mirrors but that can be arranged any way you like.
You said flash ram can be added for save files. How would this be set up? Would it be set up to swap In and out with the other windows or would it have it's own area in ram?
Only one large memory chip (ROM, RAM, Flash or other) can be set up as an array of windows but there is no restriction to what type of memory chip this may be.
If further ram expansion was added to the cart would it be capable of switching out windows as well? Could it be capable of switching 24k,32k or 35k? Or would the further expansion just be open ram for program usage?
Same as above except for the 35k - windows have to be consistent in size and there can't be more than 256 so the extra 3k cannot be windowed.
Is there any documentation concerning the cart, it's registers and anything else that I might need to know in order to organize my data and write the routines that will run the game on the cart?
There used to be a schematic online but people have used it to make clones of the cart without my permission in 2011.
As far as can a game be organized in 16k chunks? Absolutely! If you can write an game at 5k then you can write a much larger game broken up into 16k.
There are really far more possibilities than that as my answer to Ghyslain should indicate.

You can only have one large chip divided into windows but you can have it show up to the VIC as 64 windows of 32k, 128 windows of 16k or 256 windows of 8k. You can also have these windows in the BLK areas of your choosing and in the order of your choosing.

i.e. If you choose 64 windows of 32k, obviously, you'll want to use all 4 BLK areas to present the windows to the VIC but each windows doesn't have to be presented in BLK1, 2, 3, and 5 - it could be BLK3, 1, 5 and 2.

If you choose 128 windows of 16k, it could be presented in BLK1 and 2 or perhaps BLK2 and 3 or even BLK3 and 5. Maybe BLK1 and BLK5.

If you choose 256 windows of 8k then it could be presented in BLK1 or 2 or 3 or 5 ...

You can also have RAM or flash in whatever BLK areas not used for windowing. You can also have RAM or flash in the $0400-$0FFF area as well as the unused IO2 area.
With a rpg the main core of the game takes up little space. This could be done in < 16k placed in the first window. This data could then be copied placing the core routines and datake in the lower unexpanded regions of the vic.
Now all the maps, enemies, dungeon trap controls, menus, graphics, and storyline can be switched in and out as needed. Each window might contain the 16k split up with dungeon map, enemies in dungeon and there stats and data concerning items, traps, doors, puzzles and other objects and events in the dungeon.

The challenge is in making the game good enough for the price of the cart.
I think it sounds like a lot of fun. Ultimately the game has to be deigned around the cart. But the combination of the carts abilities and weaknesses will help to define the game.
I think what you see above leaves room for much more possibilities than you first anticipated, am I right ?
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R'zo
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Re: Behr-Bonz 4 game cart.

Post by R'zo »

eslapion wrote:I think what you see above leaves room for much more possibilities than you first anticipated, am I right ?
You are absolutely right. The possibilities seem virtually endless.

It will take me some time to get going on this. I have a few other projects I'm working on at the moment. It will deffinately take sometime to produce this game but it will be well worth it.

Understandable on the scematics, from this stand point all I need to know are the registers and pokes for switching out the windows and how to initialize the start up program once the cart is plugged in and the vic is turned on ( if it uses normal cart initialization I have docs for reference)

If you feel the need for anything not to be public knowledge pm me. Anything pm will not be shared.
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Re: Behr-Bonz 4 game cart.

Post by R'zo »

I believe you stated in Ghislains post that 2k flash ram could be inserted in the 3K block. Thiso would be preferable if not usable by the rest of the cart.
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Re: Behr-Bonz 4 game cart.

Post by eslapion »

R'zo wrote:I believe you stated in Ghislains post that 2k flash ram could be inserted in the 3K block. This would be preferable if not usable by the rest of the cart.
The Behr-Bonz uses the IO3 area for it's control register but the IO2 area as well as the 3k RAM expansion area are unused so you can put in there whatever you see fit. You just can't use them as window areas.
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Re: Behr-Bonz 4 game cart.

Post by R'zo »

@eslapion

Is the offer still up for this? I am working on a game that I would like to produce as a cartridge. Your design is time tested and I know you pay fine attention to detail when quality is concerned.
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Re: Behr-Bonz 4 game cart.

Post by Vic20-Ian »

R'zo wrote: Thu Dec 24, 2020 9:47 pm @eslapion

Is the offer still up for this? I am working on a game that I would like to produce as a cartridge. Your design is time tested and I know you pay fine attention to detail when quality is concerned.
I think Eslapion left this forum.
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Re: Behr-Bonz 4 game cart.

Post by R'zo »

Vic20-Ian wrote: Sun Dec 27, 2020 7:38 am
R'zo wrote: Thu Dec 24, 2020 9:47 pm @eslapion

Is the offer still up for this? I am working on a game that I would like to produce as a cartridge. Your design is time tested and I know you pay fine attention to detail when quality is concerned.
I think Eslapion left this forum.
Thank you.
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Re: Behr-Bonz 4 game cart.

Post by Noizer »

R'zo wrote: Sun Dec 27, 2020 10:15 am
Vic20-Ian wrote: Sun Dec 27, 2020 7:38 am
R'zo wrote: Thu Dec 24, 2020 9:47 pm @eslapion

Is the offer still up for this? I am working on a game that I would like to produce as a cartridge. Your design is time tested and I know you pay fine attention to detail when quality is concerned.
I think Eslapion left this forum.
Thank you.
Maybe you could ask here: viewtopic.php?f=10&t=9937
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